Leading justice groups say children should no longer be put in prison

Leading justice groups say children should no longer be put in prison; Part 2 of 2 ENGLAND: Leeds: / West London: INT Kamali Stevens (Penal Reform Solutions) LIVE 2-WAY interview SOT - re: young people act out of violence when they are not heard / staff shortages impact this / supporting people in community being plausible Mark Fairhurst (National Chair, Prison Officers Association) LIVE STUDIO interview SOT - re: there are young people in prison who commit abhorrent crimes / Kamali makes good points on staff shortages, very difficult to unlock people who are violent all of the time / would much rather charities and reform groups work with front line to invest in prisons and make them safe places Stevens LIVE 2-WAY interview SOT - re: some young people have been let down by systems put in place to protect society / we need to understand that and take accountability / a lot of young people are angry, only by building meaningful relationships that we can get through to them / lack of training of new staff hinders interpersonal relationships / understand what POA are saying, this problem goes a lot higher, to policy / but we have to understand if we are failing young people in first instance we have to be a lot more empathetic to why they got into that situation in first place Fairhurst (National Chair, Prison Officers Association) LIVE STUDIO interview SOT - re: need to work together, invest in prisons and increase staff training / there are proposals on table with government to make smaller self contained units with higher staffing ratios across country / we want to work with reform groups, but fed up of hearing there's no place for prisons; prisons are here to stay and we need them.